Introducing Season 2: Mom Guilt & Guilty Pleasures
ABOUT THE EPISODE
Welcome to the first episode of Season 2 of The Motherscope Podcast! This episode is really going to dive into my inspiration for Season 2: Mom Guilt & Guilty Pleasures. The idea for this started when mom guilt became a common topic with the guests I interviewed in Season 1 of the show. At the same time, I was having lots of fun, thought-provoking conversations with moms on social media about shows we’ve been binging and pop culture news. So, I thought it would be fun to combine the two and investigate the connections between our relationships, what we consume, and even our genetic makeup – to better understand what impacts the way we mother. Dig in with me as I share some of my preliminary findings and remember, the only thing you are guilty of is being a mom.
If you haven’t left a review for the show already and you’re listening on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, I’d be grateful if you did so that more moms can find the show. Also, you can take the conversation even further by connecting with me over onInstagram and commenting on this episode’s Instagram post.
TOPICS DISCUSSED
Why Jackie chose the word “fun” for her word of the year in 2022 and how this has played out for her so far
How pop culture can help us better understand the world around us and ourselves
What parasocial relationships are and how the pandemic has increased our capacity for them
Shame vs. guilt in the words of Brené Brown and how this can relate to what we feel as mothers
What’s to come from Season 2 and what you can expect from each episode
RESOURCES MENTIONED
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Jackie Leonard 00:00
Hi, I'm so glad you're here. It's really exciting to be starting a new season when I first started the mother scope podcast, I just kind of thought we would wing it and have episode by episode and into the new year, I really felt inspired to break it up into seasons. So we are now in season two of the mother scope podcast. Season two is going to focus on the topic of mom guilt and guilty pleasures. I plan to share a little bit more about how this idea came to be and why season two is going to focus on these two things. But first, I want to thank all the listeners who have showed up in season one who have encouraged me and just given so much positive feedback from reaching out to me privately to share something that really resonated on an episode or
Jackie Leonard 00:56
commenting that you really felt inspired by one of the guests that was interviewed. And I also want to just give a special thank you to those who have gone and written a review on Apple podcasts. These are so great to have anytime I find a new podcast that's like one of the first things I look at is the ratings and reviews. And so I've been really trying in the last few weeks to build up the reviews that we have for this podcast. I want to read a couple before we jump in. The first is from Kay Carlin, who writes great podcast about all things motherhood, I've been following mother scopes since its beginnings, and I love this new element of a podcast. I listen on my way to work each week, Jackie and the mother scope community are a great resource for moms to share their experiences and feel connected with other moms. Another one, by Let's go. Cato says a diverse and inspiring take on storytelling. The mother scope podcast is such a refreshing and inspiring take on the challenges that face mothers today. I feel such camaraderie when I listen and also learn something new. I love this podcast and the diverse set of voices and experiences it highlights. So I just wanted to share that and encourage anybody who has been listening or even as new to listening and enjoys this episode and more to go to Apple podcasts and write a short review. I really appreciate it. I want to highlight those more on this podcast as they come in. If you are new to the podcast, I really encourage you to go back and listen to season one season one of the podcast is 20 episodes, it features a couple solo episodes from me, but also 18 episodes that are interviews. And each of those interviews is really a very intimate conversation between myself and the guest, where I give them an opportunity to share one story that is closest to their heart about being a mom. And what I loved about each conversation was that regardless of the experience that that individual mom shared about, I always got feedback from people who listen that they really related to what somebody shared or reminded them of something that they had experienced, even if it wasn't exactly the same. And so I just, I'm always just really drawn to this idea that the more specific we can get, when we tell our stories, the more others can relate. So I always say specificity is universal. It's not something I coined, somebody else said it better than me. But but it's so true. And as a mom, I think it's so important to recognize that and also recognize that we there is no one way to mother and none of our experiences will be exact replicates of another mom's experience, even if we try to make it so it's just not possible. And I think we just need to embrace that even more. Embrace what makes our motherhood journey unique and that we will all be better for it. So that was season one in a nutshell. And like I said, if you're new or have missed a few episodes, I definitely encourage you to go back and listen, I don't know if you're like me. But whenever I find a podcast that I really love, I can definitely like binge and listen to all of them and catch up. So whenever you're in the mood for a podcast, listen, definitely check them out. The last bit of housekeeping I will share as this if you don't know what mother's scope is and are like I found this podcast but you keep talking about Mother scope. I don't know what that is. I encourage you to go back and listen to episode one because that's where I do share more about how I founded mother scope and what it's all about. But in a nutshell, we are a community of moms who inspire and uplift one another by writing and sharing our own stories.
Jackie Leonard 04:58
I also like to add that I I believe that everybody is a writer. And so even if you do not consider yourself competent writer, this is still the space for you, especially if you believe that stories are powerful, and that you have a story inside you that is worth sharing. So to get into the meat of this special intro to season two episode, I started at the beginning of this year really thinking about what I wanted to do in 2022, in terms of my life, and also with mother scope and, and how to handle and approach the New Year differently since for the past couple years, we've had the pandemic to contend with. And it's really taken away a lot of our ability to plan or have a vision for what's to come. And so my intention for 2022 is the word fun. And I have just tried as much as I can where I don't know, six or seven weeks into 2022. And by leading with this word in mind, I feel like I've already noticed a change in the way that I approach hardship or just challenges, like uncertainty or in decisiveness. I've just when I can't figure out what I want to do with my time I'm like, Okay, well, that's gonna be fun. Or if I'm struggling with my kids, I'm like, How can I do something that they're going to have fun with and like enjoy it myself, it's, it's been helpful, it's been a bit of a hard season, I feel like 2022 started off really weird. For lack of a better word, I it was a slow going. And of holidays. For me, I just felt like I wasn't given that big momentum boost that I was expecting that I always get it the new year. And so embracing the word fun has been really helpful for me, even when I'm struggling. And it's helped me sort of business plan for mother scope. And think of ways that I can bring more fun into this community and provide opportunities for us to just kind of relax and let loose and not take things as seriously as we as we sometimes tend to do. Because I myself at least i will say i Being a mom is something I take very seriously. And I feel like it's such a it's an honor, but it's also just this great responsibility that can be overwhelming sometimes if you're not able to embrace the fun and, and laugh a bit about it. So with all that in mind, as I was embracing this word and feeling like I was getting to a natural like end to the cycle of interviews that I was having. For the first season, I started to get curious about ways that we might shake things up with the format of this podcast. And as I was reflecting on the different things that I talked about, with the guests that I had on in season one, I felt like mom guilt kept coming up, mom guilt came up with, you know, just different stories they were sharing, it also came up a lot through our online journal that was published weekly, in the stories that were written in the poems just a lot of insecurity and apprehension and fear around wanting to do things for yourself, but worrying about what other people would think or worrying about the way that you parents and how others might judge you. And all of that really is what we come to refer to often as mom guilt. So can be anything from deciding to go back to work, or, you know, choosing an alternative birth plan that, you know, others might comment on. It just came up over and over again. And we'd often talk about like, where do we think this comes from? Like, why? Why do you feel this way? Did somebody say that to you? Or is it just something that's internal and especially when it's internal? Where did that start and because of the the format and the nature of these, these conversations, I was trying to you know, stay focused on their story and not spend too much time. You know, getting into the nitty gritty and like going back in time and looking at why we have these these beliefs. It really sparked the idea for season two, which
Jackie Leonard 09:44
like I said, it is titled it's mom guilt and guilty pleasures, because quite literally as I'm hearing a lot of stories in my conversations about mom guilt, I noticed that anytime I reference It's like a TV show or something I was listening to or watching on social media that I'd always get all these DMS, from moms in the community saying, like, oh, I watched that too, or I loved that show. And I was younger. And it sort of like clicked for me. And I started to think like, you know, if, if these were their moms out there like me, there were shows that they watched when they were a kid that they were really invested in or came to love or look back on with the nostalgia and say, Oh, wow, I love that when I was younger. But how much do we really think about what was messaged in the shows, especially now that we can go back and rewatch a lot of these now from a different perspective, it's really got me reflecting more and more about how how much these these messages had a lot to do. And with shaping us, for better or for worse, and some of my rewatches I've been pleasantly surprised. I've been like, oh, wow, that's, that was pretty progressive for its time. And there have been other times I would say probably far more often when I've rewatched things and been like, Oh, like that did not age well. And I was watching this as a teenager, I wonder like, what I internalized about, you know, after watching this, so that was all kind of brewing for a little while I was I've always been really interested in like, analyzing shows, after I've watched them or reading movie reviews after watching them to, to just see what other people think and what they pick up on. I am, you know, like I say in the intro, it's like I do have an IT degree in English. And I really think that influences the way that I interact with all forms of entertainment. I don't think you I think you could write essays and analyze anything that we consume and sell. I don't see why, you know, the TV shows we watch or the movies we watch are any different. I would say it's a bit elitist to believe or look down on people who are spending a lot of time unpacking what's represented on film and on the screens, with the same intention as we do. And we analyze literature. And maybe that's controversial to say, but, but I've never really felt like there was a difference or a distinction. And at the same time, especially to go back to this idea of guilt. I always felt like this weird shame around being a really invested movie and TV watcher and being really aware of pop culture and an interested in it and very interested in learning about what's in and what's out not from a place of wanting to like emulate it or live my life by it, but more as a way to understand the world. But I do believe that there is this kind of like guilty pleasure component to admitting like, I really love to watch. Rewatch episodes of Grey's Anatomy over and over without somebody being like, Oh, really, that's what you do with your time. And I believe I'm sure that as a mom that only feels even more shameful, like, Isn't there something better that you could be doing with your time? Shouldn't you be playing with your kids or going to sleep so you have more energy in the morning, all these things are messages that I myself have somewhere internalized from somewhere that absolutely make me feel some sense of shame for for what I'm doing, even though participating in, you know, like rewatching, an old show, or even watching something new and getting excited about it is an activity that in a weird way makes me feel like my old self, and also makes me feel like I'm in engaging with the world in a different way. And it's really interesting because I did some research. And I've heard a bit about parasocial relationships a lot lately, especially with regard to people who are really,
Jackie Leonard 14:25
like invested in celebrity culture. And for those who don't know parasocial relationships are essentially one sided relationships where one person extends emotional energy, interest and time. And the other party that persona is completely unaware of the other's existence. parasocial relationships are most common with celebrities, organizations, such as sports teams or television stars. I got this definition from a an article on prevention calm, I can link it in the show notes, but basically they're both that we kind of form in our brains with people that we don't personally know or characters that we are obviously not real. But what I found really interesting when I was investigating parasocial relationships was two things. One, that they're actually not unhealthy. They're actually, they actually can be good for us and are very normal and good for our brains. So that I found really interesting. And I'll read a little bit more about that. And then the other thing that I found that was interesting about parasocial relationships is that they have increased in during the COVID 19 pandemic. It's not necessarily surprising, but I found it interesting that it's something that's being studied and looked at. So the ways in which parasocial relationships and bonds are actually good is that they help us fill gaps in our real world relationships. So for example, if there's a character that is on a show, or in a movie, or even in a book, you're reading that you don't know anybody like that, in real life, they kind of fill in this gap for us that we we don't currently have. And we get to kind of extend empathy and understanding in a way that we couldn't based on our current situation. And they're mostly a risk, risk free way to feel more connected to the world. They can be developed developmental building blocks to for for us in our youth. And so they often take the form of crushes or admiring somebody as a role model. And so in these ways, they're actually pretty good as long as they don't get like obsessive or compulsive right. Our brains are wired to connect with others, but we're not always in situations in our lives where we have that readily available. And I would argue that as a mom, I think this is also why we are craving relationships and whatever form we can get them in and just Realistically speaking, we just don't always have the access to go out and, and make new friends or, or even engage with our friends the way we want to. And and I obviously want to caveat this, I don't even know if I need to say this if you're listening. But I feel like it's worth saying that. Obviously, these relationships don't replace real relationships. Obviously, the best is to have real meaningful relationships that are two sided and not one sided. But I do think that it is, like I said, healthy to not only solely focus on two sided two sided relationships, because they're just not always available. The other side sometimes is busy and to be able to open up a book and dive into a character or watch a TV show and really get immersed into this story. I think that is like what we as humans need. And the other thing that I wanted to share about the COVID-19 study was that the study done in May 2021 found that the pandemic has increased our capacity for parasocial relationships. So as social distancing wore on Paris social closeness increased, suggesting that our favorite media fakers became more meaningful throughout the pandemic. And maybe that some people are drawn toward people whom they admire as a way to help loneliness. And you know, for those of you if you're like me and a writer and somebody who has created fictional characters, I have absolutely been invested in the characters that I've even created myself. So I think it's very natural and it's something that we should embrace more without feeling that shame but I think that explains for if if you've found that you are binge watching things more getting really hooked on like the new Netflix movies and things like that, I think that that is our brains way of making relationships where we can have them. And I think we've been doing that our whole lives. I think that's part of being a human being is finding relationships and making connections.
Jackie Leonard 19:01
But I think it's really important to alongside that acknowledge that these relationships, the stimuli, the things we are consuming, and our influences, all are shaping who we are, we are a product of all of these things in addition to our our genetic makeup, our parents, our friends, the people who have been mentors for us like all of these things and factors shaped the person that we are today. And as I've said it absolutely affects the way we parent the way we take on our role as moms I want to share a quote from one of my favorite books if you're looking for an easy like quick read, but really like deep read, I recommend no but no mud no Lotus by ticking yet Han. He just passed away recently by just a really brilliant person and the this book especially It was just really profound for me to read. I read it at the beginning of 2021, I believe. And this is from his chapter, happiness is not an individual matter. He says, When a young person tells his parents, this is my body, this is my life, I can do what I want with it, he has only partly right, he doesn't see that he is the continuation of his parents and of his ancestors before that, this body is not yours alone, it is also the body of your ancestors. Your body is a collective product of your nation, of your people of your culture of your ancestors. So you are not strictly an individual, you are partly collective, this quote really stood out to me, especially the part about being a product of your people and your culture. And that's what I want to really unpack and get into using the entertainment that we've consumed. If you're approximately of millennial age, I think a lot of the things that I am focusing on are going to be things that you're familiar with. And acknowledging that they had an influence on some of these beliefs that we have are these these fears are these ideas. And what happens when what we are living is an opposition to or being negatively affected by by these messages that we received in our formative years. And as I was thinking about mom guilt a lot, I naturally went to like definitions and started to think about Brene Brown, because she does talk a lot about shame. And I and I wondered, like, what's the difference between shame and guilt, because I believed that like guilt, when people were talking about, quote, unquote, mom guilt, or I was thinking about mom guilt. What it really felt like was shame because it felt like something that other people were placing on US versus like us actually doing something wrong. And so, I looked at Brene Brown's definition of shame versus guilt. And this is what she says, shame is a focus on self. Guilt is a focus on behavior. Shame is I am bad guilt is I did something bad. And shame is this intensely painful feeling or experience of believing that we are flawed and therefore unworthy of love, and belonging. And I think when I first read the definition of shame, I was like, Oh, well, I don't know if it's like was that, you know, intense? When moms were sharing, like, oh, I felt guilt because of this. But when I thought about it more, I was like, well, but the guilt was not I did something bad. Like when you feel mom guilt, because you wanted to go out with your friends and your kids were upset that you were leaving them? Did they really do something bad? I don't think so. And so it really did feel like even though it sounds intense to say, the deep rooted feeling really isn't mom guilt, by definition, it's really shame. It's this idea that I'm being bad. I'm a bad mom, because I'm doing this thing that other people have suggested to me as wrong, and that I don't deserve. So I really do feel like we almost need to change the way we we refer to mom guilt and call it mom shame, because that's really what it is. I really hope that there's some interconnectedness to what's is starting to feel a little tangential all over the place. But But what I'm really getting at is that even though like I said, I want to embrace fun, and I want to have conversations about you know, TV shows, and entertainment and
Jackie Leonard 23:49
weird fads in the 2000s and, you know, iconic movies and things like that. I do feel like there's a larger purpose to it. And I want to make sure that that's clear as well. And at the same time, I think it is through these kinds of conversations, these easy entry points and talking about things that that are aren't real and that aren't so high stakes, because it's not our own lives that we can really get deep and talk more about the root cause and things that affect more people than just ourselves.
Jackie Leonard 24:24
I absolutely believe we were able to do that in the first season and in the conversations we were having. But I think this is more about like identifying and trying to unpack where and why these these ideas of of what a mom should be and what we can no longer be as moms came from, and I will just say and my preliminary just kind of like brainstorming and stuff. It really blew my mind to start paying attention in my watches, how much moms are represented as these like barrier As to happiness and also like a raced in stories. It's really fascinating and and and that's still happening and stuff that's currently made even even shows that you would say like are trying to be more intentional, I'm still seeing some glaring errors. I'm also finding it really interesting to look at who are the people that are writing these stories, who are the people that are directing them. And looking more deeply into that as well is going to be really fun. And so, to wrap up, if you're still like listening, and like, Okay, I still don't fully know what each episode is going to be like, I'll walk you through that now. So each episode is going to have some sort of cohesiveness to it, whether it's, it's going to focus on one specific show, for example, if we do Grey's Anatomy, I will have some sort of topic that we're going to discuss related to the show and pick out like a couple episodes to to use as reference points, and then talk more at large about the subject matter. So say the subject matter is being a working mom. And so we'll really like zoom in on a couple episodes from this crazy long show that, that really highlight that topic, and I might have a guest on and we'll chat about what we observed rewatching, like this one or two episodes, or just things we've noticed as a whole about the show, we'll talk a little bit about who started the show, and who are some of the main writers and things like that. And anything that really comes up, it'll have kind of like a loose format, just like a conversations dead, but it will be centered on something specific. Another type of episode might focus more on a subject and bring in different examples of different forms of entertainment, one of those episodes is going to be about birth trauma, and how the way birth is represented in shows and movies and things like that is definitely the source for a lot of the fear around birth. And then of course, as like things continue to happen in our world and current events and stuff, if there's something big that that seems to pertain to motherhood in some way, there might be a special episode that's dedicated to that in the way that the media, for example, is approaching, you know, whatever it might be coming up. So I'm also really looking into the resurgence and true crime and how, you know, big crimes involving moms have been approached and things like that. So there's really a lot of, of ways to take this. And I'm really excited to do that and bring in some special guests, I already have a few in mind that I'm really excited to have on to just just dive into these conversations that that we're lacking and not having the way we would in the past, with our co workers like the watercooler conversations are now on Twitter, and if you're not somebody that really likes to engage in that, this podcast will serve that for you. And I'll find ways that those of you who are listening will be able to engage, I am going to welcome requests if you have any like suggestion for a subject that you want to hear more about and and make it interactive in that way. So I'm excited for this. And I hope that I've shared already has you kind of spinning your wheels and thinking about all the different things that could be discussed or, or things that you are currently consuming, that are making you look at them differently. Now. At its core, I feel like the foundation of other scope or the thing that really like sparked that needed me to create a community was this this concept that ever since I became a mom, the way I saw the world had completely changed. And the way the world now Sammy was different. And I feel like as a viewer, as somebody that's consuming entertainment, I have a lens now that that has altered that for me has has made me internalize and analyze the things that I'm watching and reading so much differently. And I just really want a space to talk about that and invite others to do that with me and on their own with their own friends. And so that's what we're going to be doing here. In the spirit of fun. I'm also going to have each episode and with little game and then also review of whatever movie show or topic that we have talked about is going to get assessed as either a mom advocate a guilty pleasure or mom guilt. And at the very end the one thing that I am carrying over from season one and I think will continue for the entirety of this podcast is I'm going to end with a writing prompt as way for for you to take what we've talked about in the episode and journal about how it applies to you. So that's my rundown of why I decided to start Season Two and what it's all about. I would love if you have an Instagram account to go to Mother scopes, Instagram and finds the posts for this episode and comments, and let me know something you would love for me to discuss in season two, or somebody that you think would be a great guest to have a chat with me about this on the podcast,
Jackie Leonard 30:36
send me your thoughts, I would love it. I really am looking for ways to make this podcast more interactive. And I think that's, that's one way that you can have a hand in in the programming for the mothers go podcast. And as I said earlier, too, I really love and appreciate written reviews when they are positive. If you have any constructive feedback, you can always email me hello at Mother scope.com. But if you are enjoying this podcast, a written review is always going to brighten my day and encourage more great content as well as sharing with those that you know. I feel like whenever a friend of mine tells me about a great podcast, I always give it a try. And so anytime that you are willing to share it with your community of family and friends, it does mean the world to me so so those are all ways that you can show your love for this podcast and until next week. Remember the only thing that you are guilty of is being a mom.